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magicJack and MagicJack Plus Support, Reviews, FAQs and Hacks
magicJack and magicJack Plus Unofficial Technical Support. Your Magic Jack and Magic Jack Plus phone service information resource
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az2008
MagicJack Sensei
Joined: 20 Aug 2008
Posts: 1404
Location: Tempe, AZ
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 Posted: Wed Dec 31, 2008 2:35 pm Post subject: |
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| brittany28 wrote: | | I was watching a program that I happened to be recording when I fell asleep. The next day, when I checked my recording there was a magic jack infomercial on my tape. I just reviewed that tape, and they absolutely stated "unlimited calls" again and again. |
I wish you could get that transferred to electronic format and uploaded to YouTube. I would love to be able to refer to it.
Mark |
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| Posted: Wed Dec 31, 2008 2:35 pm Post subject: Magicjack support, tips, tricks, and hacks |
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robatino
MagicJack Expert
Joined: 29 Aug 2008
Posts: 97
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| Posted: Wed Dec 31, 2008 2:39 pm Post subject: |
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| If they had a tiny little asterisk and a footnote in microscopic text, I could see them being able to claim it's not deceptive (even though most people wouldn't have the picture resolution to be able to read it). Otherwise, no. |
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robatino
MagicJack Expert
Joined: 29 Aug 2008
Posts: 97
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| Posted: Wed Dec 31, 2008 3:07 pm Post subject: |
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I did a search for
magicjack infomercial
and found this:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bsR3b2F9sUA
It appears truncated at the end but they did say "talk as long as you want" (note they say "you", not "we") and I didn't see any footnotes though there could have been something after it was cut off. |
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az2008
MagicJack Sensei
Joined: 20 Aug 2008
Posts: 1404
Location: Tempe, AZ
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| Posted: Wed Dec 31, 2008 3:15 pm Post subject: |
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| robatino wrote: | | It appears truncated at the end but they did say "talk as long as you want" (note they say "you", not "we") and I didn't see any footnotes though there could have been something after it was cut off. |
Thanks. I've seen that before. I linked to it in the MJ wiki as an example of questionable business practices that often come up in discussions:
http://en.wikibooks.org/wiki/MagicJack/Benefits_and_Criticism/Criticism#Careless_or_Questionable_Business_Practices
I've always been able to rationalize that as "talk as long as you want" isn't the same as "unlimited." It doesn't say how *often* you can call. And, I think most reasonable, average people wouldn't expect that to mean dozens of 40-hour phone calls per month. (I'm willing to say the advertisement is speaking to the expectations of average viewers.).
But, if they really use the word "unlimited," that's more definite. I still think the average person would never expect truly "unlimited" usage. I think a person could still dismiss it as the advertisement speaking to the understanding/expectations of average viewers.
Mark |
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BuffaloChuck
magicJack Apprentice
Joined: 16 Dec 2008
Posts: 19
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| Posted: Fri Jan 09, 2009 11:08 am Post subject: |
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The software is creating too many vulnerabilities. After pointing these out via email to Dan but getting no response, this product at this point is simply not secure enough.
For those that claim 'scare tactics', I'd question their motivations. How are they benefiting from keeping MJ users on-line? Are they getting paid by Dan or are they exploiting the hacks and vulnerabilities (which is my guess)?
Maybe when Dan's promised "April" fixes show up, we can deliver a better rating. |
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nerd
MagicJack Newbie
Joined: 16 Jan 2009
Posts: 3
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| Posted: Fri Jan 16, 2009 5:26 am Post subject: just new, however.. |
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I am a technical support agent for a Cable Telecommunications company and I must say, "unlimited" is always limited to reasonable usage. You cannot beat 5000 hours of long distance out of it and not expect to be punished in some fashion. Unlimited usage means unlimited without abusing it - so if you abused it, and now you're angry, that's your fault, not theirs.
If the provider does not cap you to a reasonable limit, you are hurting the service for others. So, others, reading this ridiculous thread, should be glad the company is suspending or banning abusers of the service, that would otherwise raise the price for everyone and cause service issues with phone carriers getting your call through - there would be no availability to patch your call through. You would just get dialing to silence or give you a fast busy signal (temporary failure).
Last edited by nerd on Fri Jan 16, 2009 5:46 am; edited 2 times in total |
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nerd
MagicJack Newbie
Joined: 16 Jan 2009
Posts: 3
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| Posted: Fri Jan 16, 2009 5:34 am Post subject: |
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| Matt9876 wrote: | I've had several months of good service but now for the past two weeks incoming calls are always choppy sounding. 
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If VOIP calls are choppy, have gaps or garbled speech, it's your network or Internet provider at fault in most cases. Have your ISP technical support check for packet loss or high latency issues.
Also, VOIP does not work properly on internet "lite" packages less than approximately 200 kilobit per second in either direction, upload or download. If you so much as fart on the Internet while you're using the phone, you will get garbled speech or gaps, sometimes dropping, because the capped speed cannot handle both. |
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robatino
MagicJack Expert
Joined: 29 Aug 2008
Posts: 97
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| Posted: Fri Jan 16, 2009 5:50 am Post subject: Re: just new, however.. |
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| nerd wrote: | | I am a technical support agent for a Cable Telecommunications company and I must say, "unlimited" is always "limited" to reasonable usage. You cannot beat 5000 hours of long distance out of it and not expect to be punished in some fashion. Unlimited usage means unlimited without abusing it - so if you abused it, and now you're angry, that's your fault, not theirs. |
My dictionary defines "unlimited" differently from the way you do. It's also untrue that "unlimited" always has a "reasonable usage" limitation, even in the special case of ISPs. For example, Verizon DSL has no caps of any kind. There is no known case of anyone ever being kicked off for excessive usage. Companies that provide actual, dictionary-definition unlimited, should be distinguishable in their advertising from those that only provide "reasonable, as defined by us" unlimited.
If MJ would qualify their ads with some fine print, there wouldn't be a problem. But there isn't any. The TOS do allow for being booted for excessive use, but without any fine print, the ads are contradicting that. |
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az2008
MagicJack Sensei
Joined: 20 Aug 2008
Posts: 1404
Location: Tempe, AZ
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| Posted: Fri Jan 16, 2009 10:26 am Post subject: Re: just new, however.. |
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| nerd wrote: | | So, others, reading this ridiculous thread, should be glad the company is suspending or banning abusers of the service, that would otherwise raise the price for everyone and cause service issues with phone carriers getting your call through - |
I tend to agree with this. I didn't have a problem with the "excessive use" terminations at the end of October. My problem was (and is) that the limits aren't clearly defined. There is no warning that someone is approaching the limit. No clear disclosure that they crossed the limit (and had been terminated). Even the support group was unaware that the policy was being enforced.
I'm ok with "unlimited" being used in advertising in terms of what average users would experience. My old landline company said I would always get a dial tone when I pick up the handset. But, we all know that if *everyone* in the country picks up their handset at the same time, you're not going to get a dial tone. (Remember the common "all circuits are busy" message during Mothers Day, et. al?).
I think it's unreasonable to apply a dictionary to these things. It's generally accepted that terms like this are used within the context of "normal usage" (as defined by the average person). But, I agree with "robatino" that there should be an asterisk, and the limits clearly defined (like they are at Skype).
The way MJ handled it was the real problem. If they gave a friendly warning. And, clear indication of why the user was terminated (instead of just a phone number to call that nobody answered), I think most people (unaffected) would have thought it was a normal business practice.
Mark
_________________
See the MagicJack Wiki (FAQ, How-To, history and more). |
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g-man
MagicJack Newbie
Joined: 25 Feb 2009
Posts: 1
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| Posted: Thu Feb 26, 2009 12:35 am Post subject: Re: just new, however.. |
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| nerd wrote: | I am a technical support agent for a Cable Telecommunications company and I must say, "unlimited" is always limited to reasonable usage. You cannot beat 5000 hours of long distance out of it and not expect to be punished in some fashion. Unlimited usage means unlimited without abusing it - so if you abused it, and now you're angry, that's your fault, not theirs.
If the provider does not cap you to a reasonable limit, you are hurting the service for others. So, others, reading this ridiculous thread, should be glad the company is suspending or banning abusers of the service, that would otherwise raise the price for everyone and cause service issues with phone carriers getting your call through - there would be no availability to patch your call through. You would just get dialing to silence or give you a fast busy signal (temporary failure). |
Having gone rounds with my local cable company branch manager over the strangle hold they placed on my unlimited internet I can tell you from a cable company point of view he speaks the truth. It was just after what they called a switch outage that took down our local cable company's internet they placed a new piece of "small print" in their contract. You are allowed up to 3 meg down, but if you use the total 3 megs for over an hour they split your band width in half and the split it again at 30 minutes and then again at 30 minutes until you are slower than dialup.
I was told it was to prevent gamers from hogging the network and that I should not use that much bandwdith. I told them I creat websites for a living and I was jsut downloading via FTP a site. They said it was because of people like me taking all the bandwidth that caused the switch to blow. So I told them to shove it and moved to 7 meg DSL at qwest. Never had a problem and my internet is fast enough to watch streaming Netflix.
Now if I could jsut get rid of the rest of the money grabbing cable people that give me my TV programing... No offence nerd.. |
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az2008
MagicJack Sensei
Joined: 20 Aug 2008
Posts: 1404
Location: Tempe, AZ
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| Posted: Thu Feb 26, 2009 10:51 am Post subject: Re: just new, however.. |
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| g-man wrote: | | Now if I could jsut get rid of the rest of the money grabbing cable people that give me my TV programing... No offence nerd.. |
Personally, I don't have problems with limits. Network capacity is a perishable commodity. For example, I wouldn't expect Dan to have enough network capacity to allow *everyone* to talk 24x7. It's based upon average patterns of use. Just like the local grocery store doesn't stock an unlimited supply of apples "just in case everyone decides to buy a month's supply at once."
We'd pay a fortune if every link in the chain had to provide as much on-demand bandwidth as everyone might decide to use at the same moment. Thus begins the incentive to force outliers into the norm (throttling, caps, metered usage).
Mark
_________________
See the MagicJack Wiki (FAQ, How-To, history and more). |
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Matt9876
Dan isn't smart enough to hire me
Joined: 26 Jul 2008
Posts: 489
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| Posted: Thu Feb 26, 2009 3:37 pm Post subject: |
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Love the Wiki AZ!
Nice work all who contribute,getting more chop on incoming calls lately guess the service is getting oversold or something. |
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mberlant
Dan Should Pay Me
Joined: 01 Feb 2009
Posts: 793
Location: Japan
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| Posted: Thu Feb 26, 2009 8:10 pm Post subject: Re: just new, however.. |
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| az2008 wrote: | | Personally, I don't have problems with limits. Network capacity is a perishable commodity. For example, I wouldn't expect Dan to have enough network capacity to allow *everyone* to talk 24x7. |
In order to use the word "unlimited" in advertising it must be true. MJ must have enough network capacity to allow those who want to talk 24/7 to be able to do so. That means that the onus is on MJ's engineers and actuaries to calculate a price at which they can support those customers who do use the service much more heavily than most. If they cannot do this they cannot say "unlimited" in their advertising.
I only have heartache with caps and limits when they contradict the advertising that led me to purchase the product. The ISPs spent many years beating it into our heads that internet service is fast and unlimited. Had they said from the beginning that it was limited to some large amount they would have a case. But the word has only one meaning in the English language. |
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az2008
MagicJack Sensei
Joined: 20 Aug 2008
Posts: 1404
Location: Tempe, AZ
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| Posted: Thu Feb 26, 2009 8:27 pm Post subject: Re: just new, however.. |
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| mberlant wrote: | | In order to use the word "unlimited" in advertising it must be true. MJ must have ... |
1. When did MJ use the word "unlimited?"
2. The word "unlimited" can have the meaning expected by the average user it is targeted at. I.e., if the average user consumes 3 hours per week, then for all intents and purposes, the average user will experience "unlimited" calling.
Personally I see nothing wrong with #2. But, I'm not stupid enough to believe that anything (*anything*) is truly "unlimited" in the absolute sense of the word. When I hear it, I think "marketing" within the context of the average person the marketing is targeted at.
Mark
_________________
See the MagicJack Wiki (FAQ, How-To, history and more). |
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mikejlb
MagicJack Newbie
Joined: 16 Nov 2008
Posts: 2
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| Posted: Sat Feb 28, 2009 1:33 am Post subject: Re: just new, however.. |
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| nerd wrote: | I am a technical support agent for a Cable Telecommunications company and I must say, "unlimited" is always limited to reasonable usage. You cannot beat 5000 hours of long distance out of it and not expect to be punished in some fashion. Unlimited usage means unlimited without abusing it - so if you abused it, and now you're angry, that's your fault, not theirs.
If the provider does not cap you to a reasonable limit, you are hurting the service for others. So, others, reading this ridiculous thread, should be glad the company is suspending or banning abusers of the service, that would otherwise raise the price for everyone and cause service issues with phone carriers getting your call through - there would be no availability to patch your call through. You would just get dialing to silence or give you a fast busy signal (temporary failure). |
I renewed my Skype account recently. Skype has usage limit of 10,000 minutes a month. 10,000 / 30 = close to 6 hours a day. Some people might have a need for more than 6 hours a day, 7 days a week, but most people won't use even half that amount.
I regret buying MJ at this point because the calls cut out and have silent gaps of 20 seconds or so. I don't use a phone more than an hour a day but it appears that MJ has been less than honest in advertising and this will eventually destroy thier reputation. |
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